Insurance providers

[6597]

Well,

A happier ending for me at least, my insurance broker just completed some 'negotiating' and got my Tokio Marine/US Specialty Insurance from $956 to $810. They cited customer loyalty and accident free status. Mentioning WINGS credit and being a State Rep for a type club seemed to actually help also. Customer service isn't dead yet apparently.

FWIW she holds Global and AVEMCO in high regard, good folks to work with and 'A' rated. AVEMCO is the go to for the older pilots. Global is well diversified and covers a myriad of aviation related customers.

[2066]

"...customer loyalty and accident free status. Mentioning WINGS credit and being a State Rep for a type club seemed to actually help also. Customer service isn't dead yet apparently."

That is good news, Dave -- thanks for the update! You helped her to help you with solid info. that the company underwriter could/would accept & factor into pricing. The way it's supposed to work. Mac

[6597]

Here's a ditty from my broker that may be of interest to some folks regarding insurance premiums, I thought it was rather interesting....


There are several reasons for the tremendous rate increases which all pilots are having to experience.

Below are a few which have all contributed to this situation which we hope will stabilize soon.

1) Rates have been exceedingly low - not for years, but decades. While all costs affiliated with aviation were escalating, insurance premiums very often decreased each year at renewal.

Sometimes premiums were around $500 to $1000 less than years prior.

2) The large catastrophic losses such as the California wild fires and the East coast hurricanes have all contributed. All of our policies from aviation to home and auto, etc. are re-insured by companies at the top such as Zurich and Lloyds of London. These companies at the top help pay for claims down at the bottom like aviation, home and auto. As the companies at the top take part in paying the large catastrophic losses, it affects rates down at the bottom.

3) About seven years ago half a dozen new companies decided to enter the aviation insurance industry. In order to rake in business and bring up their reserves they offered premiums that were very low - actually too low. The other companies that had been around forever had to also lower their premiums just to try and hold on to their insureds. The new companies went out of business within a very short time leaving the other companies holding the bag with rates that were too low. In order to stay in business and pay claims, the older companies had to quickly increase all their premiums just to stay afloat.

Hopefully, premiums can stabilize soon. We have seen renewals going in this direction. As reserves increase, perhaps premiums will actually begin to decrease again.

[2066]

"...solid info. that the company underwriter could/would accept & factor into pricing. The way it's supposed to work."

A quick follow up RE this expensive piece of aircraft ownership. When shocking renewal premium increases show up it's always a good idea to contact the agent (or, underwriter, if AVEMCO) to question and provide solid reasons why we're really good & insurable "risks". Quite often it's discussions of "extensive" Flight Reviews, participation in Wings programs as well as just being intensely involved with local and national aviation organizations' training and education programs that can influence further discounts. As Dave's agent explained, across the board premiums for all companies are increasingly evident -- averages seem to be at least 10% (that means that some are much more, of course). In any event, a call to my insurer just netted me a further discount of 17% off the quoted renewal premium for some "training activities" that had been overlooked. Yep, "the way it's supposed to work", FWIW. Mac

[ghorn]

I was with the same underwriter as Dave (Tokio Marine) via a different agency (Falcon) and last year when I attempted to renew… I reconsidered several things:
1- The fact the agency representing Tokio required me to fill out a long form each year…after year…after year…instead of allowing me to simply update the previous years’ info …. was an unnecessary irritation.

2- The fact that they would not simply “renew” the existing policy they’d been writing year after year after year…. was also an unnecessary irritation.
3- The fact that completely UNrequested information was supplied by the particular individual/agent whom I’d done business with for over ten years….out of the blue… mentioned that at some point she would not be surprised to see me denied coverage because I was approaching mid-70ss…and despite my lack of claims, accidents, violations, and despite my advanced ratings and high-time in make/model…
4- When I asked “What should I be thinking about when that day arrives?”…she responded “Well,…about the only underwriter I know that does not cancel due to age is AVEMCO.” … kinda made me think…

….WHY would I renew with anyone who actually planned to cancel me someday despite a claim-free history and despite advanced ratings and regular recurrency-training….??

…WHY wouldn’t I simply Go-Ahead and establish a relationship with the company I’ll likely be soliciting coverage-from in the future…?

Conclusion: I should go ahead and establish a good relationship NOW.

THEN I remembered something from several decades-ago… I used to insure with AVEMCO. I stopped because I did not like their “Family Exclusion” policy. (The most common passengers I had were immediate family…yet immediate family was excluded from the same level of coverage afforded non-family members.

So I called AVEMCO. Guess what? They no longer have Family Exclusions.

They also allow partial-payment plans. And temporary non-use/storage reduction of premium if the airplane is not being used for the season. Immediate re-activation is no problem.
They do not cancel if your medical expires or your annual inspection accidentally expires. They cover Basic Med. They give discounts for my CFI.
And they allow me to operate off grass fields without charging extra.
AND THEY AUTOMATICALLY RENEW without making be fill out long renewal paperwork!

Their rate was also favorable, despite my recent increase in hull value declaration.

One more thing: Over two decades ago, I was insured with AVEMCO, …and in my absence at Ruidoso, someone moved my airplane and caused hangar rash on my right leading edge. It was going to cost $7K to replace that leading edge. I dragged my feet on repair because I didn’t trust just anyone to do the repair on my airplane. When I finally realized that the “ding” was exactly in my right wing where my factory left-wing land/taxi lights were installed….I had a brainstorm to simply replace that “ding”…with right-wing land/taxi lights in a “mirror-image” installation. I called AVEMCO and asked if instead of me replacing that right leading edge….for $7K…(I had a $1K deductible)…If instead of AVEMCO paying $6K of that claim…Would they allow me to spend a Lot Less on a modification..??
AVEMCO said they could not find my previous damage claim because over 7 years had passed since the damage…they’d call me back.

Next day, they called me back…and said they’d found my previous damage claim and asked what was my request? I said, I’d like AVEMCO to pay only $3500 instead of $6K… and instead of me replacing the entire outer leading edge…I’d have a reputable shop they were familiar with…install Dual Land/Taxi lights and a baggage-door instead for that $3500 payment. AVEMCO agreed!

That’s my experience with AVEMCO. Guess who I’m insured with now for the rest of my flying days?

The “ragged” edge appearance is an optical-illusion due to the camera pixels… it cannot be differentiated from a factory installation.

bag door from a C172

IMG_0257.jpeg (31.52 KiB) Viewed 9931 times

Work done by Mountain Airframe, Mena, AR.

Land/Taxi lights in right wing to match left wing

IMG_0258.jpeg (24.54 KiB) Viewed 9931 times

[2066]

Thanks for sharing your insurance "journey", George! I, too, recall "way back" just automatically insuring with Avemco, first for renter's coverage and, then, for hull & liability when the 140 joined the family. Always easy to do biz with. As I've admitted (quietly ) in more recent years, I'm almost embarrassed now that I didn't stay with them over the "mid" years instead of chasing a few bucks savings with the "other" aviation insurers who would gladly take my money, then likely choose to leave me one day. I, too, did go home to Avemco a while back when Falcon & all of the companies that they represent started giving the same kinds of hassle & signals that you mention. Dealing truly "direct" with solid, authorized, cordial, customer-appreciating employees who all seem to demonstrate common sense is refreshing. Premium difference, if any, is likely less than a couple of spark plugs costs these days and well(!) worth it IMO. Mac